Daar word op die oomblik in die kerk meer gepraat oor self-ontplooiing as oor self-opoffering.-Anon.......As ‘n kerk haar woorde begin devalueer, dan word die kerk ‘n ramp vir die volk. - K Schilder

1/10/2009

Gaum se artikel oor fundamentalisme "amuseer"....

Frits Gaum se artikel in By ("Fundamentalisme - wat dit is - en nié is nie) van 3 Januarie waaroor Mart verlede week 'n plasing begin het, amuseer vir Sakkie Spangenberg.... Lees verder in opmerkings.

10 comments:

Henrietta said...

UITLEG VAN BYBEL OOK TER SPRAKE.(Brief van Spangenberg in BY)

"Frits Gaum se artikel in By ("Fundamentalisme - wat dit is - en nié is nie) van 3 Januarie het my geamuseer. Hy sien duidelik die splinter in fundamentaliste se oog raak, dog kyk verby die balk in sy eie oog.

As hy eerlik wil wees, moet hy erken Augustinus (die argitek van die erfsondeleer) het meer in Gen 1-3 gelees as wat daar geskryf staan. Vele Bybelwetenskaplikes het dit al uitgewys, maar kerklike teoloë volhard om die erfsondeleer te verkondig.

Fundamentalisme het nie net te doen met 'n verkeerde lees van Bybeltekste nie, maar ook met die verkondiging van kerlike leerstellings gegrond op foutiewe Bybeluitleg. Dis tyd om met die AUgustiniaanse paradigma van die Christelike godsdiens (sondeval-verlossing-eindoordeel) te breek. Wie meen laasgenoemde was die kern van Jesus se boodskap, lees die evangelies deur die bril van die kerklike leer - en ook dit kan as fundmentalisme geklassifiseer word" (Einde van Spangenberg se brief).

Wat mens amuseer en nie amuseer nie, sê natuurlik ook iets oor mensself - of wat praat ek alles?

Henrietta said...

Wat hier in Spangenberg se brief ter sprake kom, is dinge soos
hamartiologie (die leer oor die sonde) en soteriologie (die leer aangaande redding).

Skryf een van ons bloggers baie onlangs aan my : “ (Sommige mense wil) Christus as maar net nog 'n gewone mens/profeet ... afmaak...alles vir die woordjie "SONDE" se onthalwe - die doring in menige se vlees, en wat sekeres so koorsig laat tekere gaan . As daar nie so iets soos sonde bestaan nie is die lewe mos te wonderlik en kan ons mos maak en sê nes ons lekkerkry sonder om skuldig te voel...”

Ek het geantwoord na aanleiding van wat ’n kennis van my te sê gehad het oor soorgelyke sake: dat mense graag sonde en Jesus as verlosser uit die prentjie wil hê, want dan kan hulle sondig soos hulle wil, en dan hoef hulle teenoor niks en niemand verantwoording te doen nie, nie hier op aarde nie, en ook nie eendag in die hemel nie .......

Mart said...

Maar natuurlik wil sekere mense Jesus uit die prentjie hê.

Lyk my soos ons aangaan, dink die slim ateïste, agnostici, New Agers, nuwe hervormers en 'liberale Christene' sommer vir ons 'n hele nuwe geloof uit.

Wag maar, dit kom! Hulle werk HARD daaraan.

Henrietta said...

Ja, Mart, dis mos dieselfde indruk wat ekself ook al 'n hele ruk kry : dat daar hard gewerk word aan 'n nuwe "geloof".

Nou wonder ek so by my sigselwers : hoe sal hierdie mense se "belydenisskrifte/geloofsbelydenis" lyk??

Liza-Nel said...

Dalk so iets:

1. Thou SHALT NOT believe all thou art told.
2. Thou SHALT seek knowledge and truth constantly.
3. Thou SHALT educate thy fellow man in the Laws of Science.
4. Thou SHALT NOT forget the atrocities committed in the name of god.
5. Thou SHALT leave valuable contributions for future generations.
6. Thou SHALT live in peace with thy fellow man.
7. Thou SHALT live this one life thou hast to its fullest.
8. Thou SHALT follow a Personal Code of Ethics.
9. Thou SHALT maintain a strict separation between Church and State.
10. Thou SHALT support those who follow these commandments.

PS. NOTE: Freethought and tolerance obviously prohibit these from being "commandments"! Just consider them "suggestions".
-Ethical Atheist's Commandments

Liza-Nel said...

...of dalk so iets-

The Atheists Creed

We believe in Marxfreudanddarwin
We believe everything is OK
as long as you don't hurt anyone
to the best of your definition of hurt,
and to the best of your knowledge.

We believe in sex before, during, and
after marriage.
We believe in the therapy of sin.
We believe that adultery is fun.
We believe that sodomy’s OK.
We believe that taboos are taboo.

We believe that everything's getting better
despite evidence to the contrary.
The evidence must be investigated
And you can prove anything with evidence.

We believe there's something in horoscopes
UFO's and bent spoons.
Jesus was a good man just like Buddha,
Mohammed, and ourselves.
He was a good moral teacher though we think
His good morals were bad.

We believe that all religions are basically the same-
at least the one that we read was.
They all believe in love and goodness.
They only differ on matters of creation,
sin, heaven, hell, God, and salvation.

We believe that after death comes the Nothing
Because when you ask the dead what happens
they say nothing.
If death is not the end, if the dead have lied, then its
compulsory heaven for all
excepting perhaps
Hitler, Stalin, and Genghis Kahn

We believe in Masters and Johnson
What's selected is average.
What's average is normal.
What's normal is good.

We believe in total disarmament.
We believe there are direct links between warfare and
bloodshed.
Americans should beat their guns into tractors .
And the Russians would be sure to follow.

We believe that man is essentially good.
It's only his behavior that lets him down.
This is the fault of society.
Society is the fault of conditions.
Conditions are the fault of society.

We believe that each man must find the truth that
is right for him.
Reality will adapt accordingly.
The universe will readjust.
History will alter.
We believe that there is no absolute truth
excepting the truth
that there is no absolute truth.

We believe in the rejection of creeds,
And the flowering of individual thought.

If chance be
the Father of all flesh,
disaster is his rainbow in the sky
and when you hear

State of Emergency!
Sniper Kills Ten!
Troops on Rampage!
Whites go Looting!
Bomb Blasts School!
It is but the sound of man
worshipping his maker.


-Steve Turner wrote this poem years ago. It reminds us of how futile life would be if there weren't a God...

Henrietta said...

Interessante stukke wat jy vir ons hier geplaas het, Liza!

Vir 'n humanis (vir wie die MENS die middelpunt van die heelal is, soos 'n god is,) is dit seker moeilik om nederig genoeg te wees om te aanvaar dat mens 'n sondige wese is wat 'n Verlosser nodig het...

Henrietta said...

Spangenberg sê by implikasie dat "sondeval-verlossing-eindoordeel" nie die "kern van Jesus se boodskap" was nie.

Wat sou julle sê is die kern van Jesus se boodskap?

Gideon said...

ALLES in Gods Woord gaan juis daaroor!!

Henrietta said...

Soos Gideon sê, mens kan nie die twee testamente losmaak van mekaar nie. Jesus self het by meer as een geleentheid na die OT verwys ( Mat 5:17; Luk 4; Luk 24:44).

By die aanvang van sy aardse bediening al verklaar Jesus: “Bekeer julle want die koninkryk van die hemel het naby gekom” (Mat 4:17) . Keer op keer herhaal Hy hierdie oproep tot bekering (Luk 5:32;
Mat 12:41; Luk 13:3,5). Waarvan anders as sondes, moet mens jou bekeer? Wat is die “koninkryk van die hemele? As daar ‘n koninkryk is, moet daar ‘n koning (ons weet mos Wie) wees en ‘n “grondwet”. Die Bergrede kan gesien word as deel van so ‘n grondwet.